It would not hurt to buy weapons and military equipment (AME):
1. Be clear about where and how the sample will be used. Is there a need for it at all?
2. There should be objective evaluation criteria and performance indicators of the samples. How does the sample meet the highest requirements?
3. It must be understood that the purchase of this type of weapons occurs from countries that define the Russian Federation as a potential adversary. Will not all this equipment stop working at hour X, as was the case with the "western" air defense systems in Iraq in 1991?
4. Always and everywhere priority is given to the domestic manufacturer. Imports are purchased until the production of the closest analogue is established.
This is how equipment manufactured in the Russian Federation is sold all over the world. For some reason, we prefer to buy with our own "specifics".
If with a big "stretch" it is possible to admit the inability of the Russian Federation to build modern universal ships (although no one clearly substantiated the need for the Mistral), then it is absolutely impossible to admit the fact that we cannot develop and produce modern wheeled armored vehicles.
Why was the Iveco LMV M65 chosen, although there is a better technique, for example Dingo2 and Eagle lV? - No answer.
We have already heard tales about what Iveco will produce. There will be an assembly type at the facilities of Kamaz, taking into account the fact that imported bridges, boxes, engines are also being installed on Kamaz - the situation looks generally sad.
Comfort
"Iveco" type is capable of carrying 5 people. Layout 2 + 3 in two rows across the car. The driver and commander are practically (first row) isolated by a partition made of struts (which can only be removed in a peaceful environment and having enough time + the necessary tools). Those. pulling out the driver in case of problems with him is possible only from the outside. The back row is cramped, and therefore fully equipped soldiers will not be able to travel in the car for a long time.
Firing through the hatch is possible only by one soldier from the second row, or only by the commander using remote-controlled weapons. On the "Tiger", it is possible to fire through the hatch by two soldiers in different directions. The main complex includes a 30-mm grenade launcher + 12, 7-mm machine gun. The installation of remotely controlled weapons is not a problem, just give money:)
Reloading weapons in "Iveco" under enemy fire is almost impossible due to the placement of ammunition (including for personal weapons) … on the roof of the car and in the unarmored aft compartment. It is impossible to fire from personal weapons, because there are no loopholes and it is impossible to open windows. The "Tiger" has loopholes. Regarding the low efficiency of fire from them - any return fire makes the enemy nervous and is the shooting of, say, 50 horns to AK commensurate with the loss of a car worth from 5 million rubles?
Evacuation in "Iveco" from the second row is possible only to the left or right, as well as through the hatch. From the first row, the driver is evacuated only to the left, the commander only to the right. This means that when overturning on one of the sides, one soldier will remain in the car and will not be able to get out until a crane or a car with a powerful winch comes to the rescue. The distance in "Iveco" between the inter-row struts and the second row of seats is small, which poses a threat … fracture of the legs of the soldiers sitting in the second row, when the car moves over rough terrain, sharp braking or an accident.
Salon "Tiger" is a one-volume armored capsule, it can transport 6 people according to the 2 + 2 + 2 scheme. Any soldier from the crew can take the driver's seat without going outside. Two soldiers can shoot through the hatch at the same time in two different directions, while the rest can shoot in almost all directions, including towards the stern, from any type of personal weapon, including grenade launchers. The 4 soldiers accommodated in the troop compartment in full gear are more than spacious and comfortable.
Due to the limited booked volume, "Iveco" does not allow it to be used as a KShM, a special electronic warfare vehicle, an armored medical vehicle, etc. More comfortable chairs in "Iveco" are simply explained:) The customer of "Tigers" - the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, wanted simpler chairs in them … h and other materials from NATO countries.
Security
The assessment of the security level of Iveco LMV M65, carried out by experts through external examination and study of the available documentation, raises serious doubts about its declared protective properties -3rd level of protection according to STANAG 4569 (not to mention the compliance of its 6a protection class according to GOST R 50963-96) … And that's why. Armored glass has a thickness of no more than (!) 60 mm, while domestic armored glass for protection class 6a has a thickness of about (!) 70 mm. At the same time, it is recognized all over the world that armored glass produced in the Russian Federation is by far the most durable and usually 1, 2-1, 5 times thinner than imported samples, with the same ballistic resistance.
"Armored capsule" "Iveco" is a fiction, there is a kind of structure, such as a frame made of pipes, on which ceramic and steel panels are installed with the help of fasteners. The armor is made of ceramics made in Germany, which in Italy is combined with a substrate made of high-strength polyethylene made in Holland.
Even the United States did not receive the technology for the production of this armor, so who decided that it would be sold to us? The beauty of the type is that such armor is 40% lighter than armor steel, but also an order of magnitude more expensive. In addition to everything, the substrate at low temperatures simply turns ceramic panels into a coating that … cracks when hit by a bullet.
Domestic ceramic armor is made on an aluminum substrate, it comes out about 10-15% heavier, but more reliable and the armor works in the cold. The joints between the ceramic panels at "Iveco" are covered with just steel armor, the durability of which is also questionable. The Italians parry quickly: "… our technical documentation allows up to 15% of weakened zones of the surface area." Those. it turns out that 2-3 meters of square "armored capsules"
"Iveco" is not protected
In the Russian Federation, GOST does not allow weakened zones on armored vehicles related to military equipment. For collectors, you can, for the army, you can’t!
If the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation took care of the lives of the soldiers, would it be easier to order panels based on aramid thread? Such a panel is lighter than a ceramic one (1 sq. M. A little more than 4 kg, versus only 20 kg of one polyethylene substrate without ceramics.), Provides good ballistic protection, fire safety and sound insulation. For such a package you need at least 4 kg of such a thread, and its price is 14,000 rubles … per kg, imported Kevlar and Twaron are cheaper, but thicker and heavier.
A few words about standards
When determining the correspondence of the resistance of protection in the West, it is considered that it corresponds to the declared standard, if it is not pierced by 50 (!) Percent of the bullets hit (shells, missiles, etc.) plus one. In other words, if you shoot at Iveco from SVD with cartridges with a B-32 bullet from 100 meters or more, and from a shot magazine 4 bullets pierce the defense and kill 4 crew members out of 5, then all the same, by Italian standards, the protection of the car corresponds to the norm! According to GOSTs of the Russian Federation, this is unacceptable! In our country, non-penetration is the formation on the inner side of a bulge with a micro crack, through which kerosene seeps (and does not flow!). And if this happens after at least one hit out of 100, the defense will not be up to par.
The "Tiger" is specially designed to ensure 100% protection, so the design of the "Tiger" armored capsule was created with these requirements in mind. Special technical solutions in difficult places (hinges, door locks, etc.) made it necessary to increase the weight of the car by more than 200 kg. Engineers of "Iveco" saved on this …
Realizing a significant difference in the cost of steel armor and ceramics with a nonMe substrate, it is not in favor of the latter (several thousand rubles versus 2000 euros per square meter) and realizing the lack of technology, equipment and specialists in repairing combat damage to ceramic armor in the RF Ministry of Defense and other departments (and after 2, maximum 3 bullets hit the ceramic armor panel, it must be changed), our specialists made the "Tiger" from high-strength armor steel.
The army version of the "Tiger" GAZ-233014 is made according to the 3rd class of protection in accordance with GOST R 50963-96 (or according to the 1st level according to STANAG 4569), i.e. inferior to the level of protection "Iveco". BUT! As it turned out, the 3rd class of protection for the "Tiger" was defined in the TZ by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation! For example, for the Ministry of Internal Affairs "Tigers" GAZ-233036 are delivered made according to the 5th class of GOST (2nd level STANAG).
Recently it became known that our specialists have developed a new armor steel, capable of providing the crew with a 6a class of ballistic protection according to GOST (and not the 3rd level according to STANAG with Italian simplifications), with almost the same thickness and weight of the "Tiger". Technologically advanced and much cheaper than ceramics, and most importantly, reliable!
Mobility
The site "MK" posted a video of cross-country tests in the winter in Bronnitsy near Moscow. There you can clearly see how "Iveco", having driven 10-15 meters through the snow, dug in and stood in it. The "Tiger" was driving like on a good dirt road. After that, the comparative tests stopped. Acts of testing "Iveco" were issued with a positive (?!) result for it, although according to the plan it was supposed to extend the tests until the fall of 2010. As the Russian media reported later, in June 2010. By order of the RF Ministry of Defense "Iveco" (more precisely "trash") was adopted by the RF Armed Forces. The Tiger's suspension is borrowed from the battle-tested BTR-80. "Iveco" turned into a military vehicle from a civilian SUV.
"Iveco" is supplied with a 3-liter 190 hp diesel engine. and a torque of 456Nm. It is not possible to install a more powerful engine due to the density of the layout. Domestic "Tigers" are still supplied with American diesel "Cummings" 5, 9 liters. 205hp and 705Nm. There is an option with a diesel engine of 420hp. The "Tiger" is being tested with a fully domestic diesel engine of 240hp. It was the American diesel that for a long time prevented the Tiger from becoming a full-fledged combat unit in the Russian army. According to the requirements of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, all weapons and military equipment should consist of domestic components. Italy has already become a subject of the Russian Federation !? Nevertheless, a completely foreign car is accepted for supply to the RF Armed Forces. How is this possible!?
According to the characteristics declared by the Italians, "Iveco" remains operational from -32C to + 49C. Domestic specialists must ensure the operating range from -50C to + 50C. This is a standard requirement for all weapons and military equipment in our Armed Forces. There is nothing new here. However, meeting these requirements costs a lot of money and time. Why is the Russian Armed Forces adopting a foreign model that does not meet these requirements ?!
Price
"Tiger" costs about 5 million rubles. for the car. The preliminary cost of Iveco LMV M65 when organizing the assembly will be approximately … 20-23 million rubles per car !. We do not have to talk about the localization of Iveco production, since it contains not only Italian components: international armor, the box - German ZF, the remotely controlled weapon module - Norwegian, etc.
Will these NATO countries sell their technology to us? - Doubtful, to put it mildly. You can still write a lot and in detail about this, but it is clear that "Iveco" does not meet the requirements and "ruining" "Tiger" for the sake of "Iveco" is at least sabotage."Tigers" are already in service almost throughout the entire territory of the Russian Federation, and, according to the "MIC" LLC, are used in 10 more countries of the world - in Europe, Asia, the Middle East and Latin America. It is known for certain from media reports that the Tigers have already mastered the territory of China, Israel, Jordan and Brazil, and the possibility of organizing an assembly in Azerbaijan is being discussed. The cost of "Iveco" is 3 times higher than domestic counterparts, with equal or inferior indicators.
It is easy to conclude from all of the above that the adoption of "Iveco" into service and their purchase for the RF Armed Forces is inexpedient and unjustified. Nevertheless, in accordance with the draft State Armaments Program, it is planned to purchase 1,775 of these armored vehicles for the needs of the RF Armed Forces for a total amount of 30 billion rubles. The purchase of a similar number of modified "Tigers" would cost 20 billion rubles less and would provide jobs for thousands of Russian citizens, not Italian.
Against the background of the foregoing, and even if we recall the story of the Mistral, Israeli drones, the installation of NATO weapons on the ships of the Navy, the purchase of some kind of armor production technology, field camps, kitchens (!) From the FRG …. Decide for yourself how it looks like … Is it that even kitchens, diesel generators, showers, etc. are not capable of manufacturing in our industry ?!
"Thank you" to you (you know who) for this!
